We continue to receive many interesting and pertinent questions from our visitors!
OTHER VISITOR QUESTIONS
Q: Will Active-Spoke work on my bike? Active-Spoke is designed for a 700c rear wheel with rounded, oval or bladed spokes using a radial spoke pattern on the non-drive side of the wheel (i.e. a spoke pattern where the spokes do not cross over each other on the side opposite of the cassette). Active-Spoke will operate with a 650c size wheel. However, the calibration tables provided in the user manual will be inaccurate. Typically, for 650c wheels select a spring set that is one level higher e.g. if you need ELITE springs, select PRO.
Q: The spokes on my rear wheel’s non-drive side cross over. What do I do? Measure the distance between the rim and the spoke cross-over near the hub. If this distance is 9” or greater, the Active-Spoke will operate effectively. If this distance is less than 9” (e.g. a Crow Foot spoke pattern), the installation of the Active-Spoke weights will be too close to the rim to be effective; this is not recommended.
Q: How much weight does Active-Spoke add to the bike? In the Six Set configuration, the total weight including springs, bolts, nuts and set weights, the mass is below 300g (10.5oz) roughly the weight of half of a water bottle. While a user could purchase and add additional sets to a wheel, studies have shown that 9oz (255g) of dynamic weight provides optimum performance.
Q: Does Active-Spoke make noise? At slow speeds (<10mph/16kph), the springs may rattle a little but as tension on the springs increases, this mild noise disappears.
Q: Comparatively speaking, how fast is an Active-Spoke wheel? The benefits of Active-Spoke technology are dependent on the profile of the course being ridden. On a typical, out and back, rolling course, studies indicate that an Active-Spoke wheel will provide between 3 and 5 seconds per mile. As a comparison, a typical high-end, deep section 50mm wheel reduces drag by 0.4lbs and saves 2.4sec/mile compared to a standard 32 spoke wheel .
Q: I guess my main question is why can't you use Active-Spoke on a front wheel? I could see an advantage in a rolling ITT but most people run rear disks in TTs. Are you afraid of some gyroscopic effect on steering? A: Our testing was done on the rear wheel to minimize drag. Also, our insurance carriers wanted Active Spoke installed exclusively on the rear as that's where all our testing was conducted. We did, informally, try Active-Spoke on a front wheel which had centered spokes using a third, center axle... no gyroscopic effect was reported. However, at this time, we do not endorse the installation and/or use of Active-Spoke on the front wheel. Lastly, we're releasing a bladed version in March and, due to demand, an Active- Spoke disc wheel is now in the works...
Q: Will my Zipp 404s work with Active-Spoke? A: Zipp 404s have a radial spoke pattern. However, with a 40mm deep rim section, the spoke travel distance is limited. For this reason, we recommend that you step up one level on your spring tension selection i.e. if you intend to select an ELITE spring (17 to 23mph), rather select a PRO spring (21 to 26mph) as the Active-Spoke weight sets will travel to within 40m of the rim compared to within 25mm of the rim on a typical shallow section rim. Note: certain Zipp 404 models have bladed spokes. Remember to select this option when ordering. NOTE: Zipp is a registered trademark of Zipp Speed Weaponry. Statements made of other manufacturer's product is based on our research and/or our opinion using our best efforts to obtain the correct information.
Q: Do I need different weights based on the course and my speed? For example I might average 21-22mph on a fairly flat course. Which weight do I get if any? On a hillier course I might average 18-19. Which weights do I get? A: In this case, the Elite spring set offers a broad calibration of 17 to 23 mph. So you would use this spring option. When you plan your ride, you add/remove the center weight (a 30sec activity) to fine tune the calibration closer to 22mph (i.e remove weight) or closer to 17mph(i.e. add weight). Take a look at our recommended configurations under Personalise
Q: Do you need to remove the wheel spokes to install Active-Spoke? A: No, you don't need to remove wheel spokes. The Active-Spoke weight sets slide over the spoke and lock together firmly over the spoke. The springs curl over the spoke. Download our user manual for details
Q: What shape of spokes will these fit on? A: The current version of Active Spoke works with round, oval and bladed spokes. The BLADED spoke width cannot exceed 3.5mm (9/64"). Some Mavic bladed spokes are 5mm and too wide to be used. OVAL and ROUND spokes will accommodate widths of 2.2mm (5/64") or less
Q: Can you actually feel the added momentum effect provided by Active-spoke? A: A few seconds per mile is difficult to detect while you're riding. So, the way to determine the impact of Active-Spoke, is to ride it hard on a route where you have established good baseline timing data and then compare your Active-Spoke performance over a period of a few runs. Rider's do report that when riding Active-Spoke for a while on a familiar course, when they switch back to a standard wheel, they feel their riding performance is 'flat' (i.e. unresponsive).
Q: What is the best/worst course to ride an Active-Spoke wheel? A: As part of the Active-Spoke performance studies, experiments considered slopes of 200 to 600 meters, varying in slope from 2% to 6% - both up and down hill. As an outcome, here are the basic rules of thumb - Beneficial routes: deceleration situations (i.e. coming out of a downhill or entering an uphill); short uphills (i.e. less than 100 meters) where momentum can be maintained. Detrimental routes: sustained uphills where the added weight of Active-Spoke begins to become significant. For this reason, we recommend no more than 300g of added weight. All tests and experiments stated in the documentation used 300g or less Active-Spoke weight. So, in practice,
a relatively fast, rolling hill course with gradients of less than 4% would be ideal for an Active- Spoke wheel.
a sustained uphill, steep gradient course would not offer any benefits. In this case we would recommend that Active-Spoke simply be removed from the wheel.
Q: My rear wheel has a radial spoke pattern and 28 spokes - 14 spokes on the non-drive side. How do I install Active-Spoke, given that I can't evenly space the weights around the wheel... A:Good question! Consider installing weights on spokes on either side e.g. 3 spokes on one side and the identical installation on the opposite spokes. See diagram.
Q: The physics doesn't make sense to me...going up a hill, you're carrying more weight; cresting the hill, you're going to take longer to speed up... so your Roll Down test may be accurate but it's not the whole picture... A: You’re absolutely correct in your assessment. We’re certainly not challenging the physics. We’re just saying that on a typical, rolling course, the benefits outweigh the disadvantages. As a simple, practical example - every time we ride, we are faced with four possible scenarios where a change in speed may occur due to the course:
D/Hill deceleration - there has been general agreement that coming out of a downhill, there’s a benefit to Active-Spoke. This is substantiated in the Roll-Down study. Note the chart below - Decel Region.
Uphill Decelerate - upon entering an uphill at speed, Active-Spoke will, for an initial period, take you further up the hill for the same effort due to the added momentum provided.
D/Hill Accelerate - when beginning from a stand-still, the Roll Down Study's chart below indicates the penalty for pushing the weights out is negligible as gravity is helping the rider accelerate. However, If you ride at speed into a downhill, there is no penalty as the weights would already be at the rim.
Uphill Accel - - during the climb portion, the rider carries the added weight of Active-Spoke up the hill. Consider though, that we’re talking between 200 and 300 grams (9 to 11oz) of essentially static weight (about half a bottle of water).Once the rider crests the hill and enters a flat portion, he/she would require added power to move the weights back out to the rim as speed increases.
So, if the course is a climb or a stepped climb, Active-Spoke has no advantages and we recommend the weight sets be removed for that race. However, given the above description, on a rolling course with zero net elevation, we have found Active-Spoke performs at ~+3 to +5% faster than an equivalent wheel without Active-Spoke.
Q: What if a spring breaks? What's the safety aspects to this technology? A: Firstly, the weight components are fabricated to the highest quality standards and been tested to make sure they operate reliably and safely. We have been testing versions of the Active-Spoke technology for approximately 10 months under various riding profiles - from Z4 time trials to interval workouts, to long endurance rides to short sessions. We have had situations with early prototypes (using rubber bands!) where the weights have either stuck at the rim or the band has come loose during a ride - all without incident or compromising our safety. I'm not suggesting you ride under faulty conditions. I'm just letting you know that we have experienced them. Per the question, if a spring broke... it is a simple 30 sec operation to unscrew and remove the components. Note: you would remove the opposite spoke weight as well. ONE POINT - FOR MANY OF THESE REASONS, YOU MUST ONLY INSTALL ACTIVE-SPOKE ON THE REAR WHEEL. FRONT WHEEL INSTALLATIONS WILL VOID ALL WARRANTIES AND LIABILITIES.
Q: Is Active-Spoke technology patented? A US convention patent has been filed. A PCT patent application provides broad international coverage. At this point, Active-Spoke technology has ‘Patent Pending’ status.
THANKS FOR YOUR INTEREST AND SUPPORT FOR ACTIVE-SPOKE.
Recently, the COZYBEEHIVE blogspot reported on Active Spoke. I asked Ron, the blog's host, if I could post his valuable and pointed questions as they would be of interest to all our visitors. So, with his permission, here's Ron's TEN questions:
1. Won't the addition of more weight effectively counteract any difference in inertias achieved? Our team focused on field trials, so I can comment in this manner. We conducted credible field trials on a rolling, zero net elevation course in Boulder, CO. The field trial protocol and run details are posted on our site. The outcome resulted in a 5.6sec/mile advantage for Active Spoke over an equivalent standard wheel. We also have 20 evaluation sites which test Active Spoke. The sites that conducted timed trials of Active Spoke (numbering 4), all reported performance benefits of between 4 and 6 sec/mile. This is consistent with our findings in our formal studies.
2. Does this work reliably under various conditions? I assume you’re asking about freezing and/or muddy conditions... Active Spoke has worked reliably during our trials and testing due to two primary reasons: it has an oversize hole (i.e. it’s not a snug fit on the spoke– it floats to a degree); the forces associated with weight movement are substantial (~2.5lbs to move weight to and from rim). Lastly, Active Spoke was designed for 700c road bikes where adverse conditions are typically mild compared to other bike categories.
3. Will it make rattling noises when the wheel is in motion? Yes - at slow speeds (<10mph), there is a minor background noise. However, perceptions seem to vary. Some evaluation sites have reported springs sounds… others have specifically mentioned it is not audible. It seems to vary based on the spring selection (Elite vs Pro which have a different diameter) and the road surface. As speed increases beyond 10mph, any perceived sounds disappear. We are currently testing a nylon spiral which will fit between the spring and spoke that will eliminate the noise.
4. Will the pieces dent the rim? Good question. The Active Spoke weight’s outward velocity is a function of the wheel’s acceleration. Given the overall mass of the rider/bike combination, acceleration is limited as is the velocity of the weight to the rim. However, it should be noted that when the bike is mounted on a low resistance trainer, quick accelerations are possible. In our testing using FSA, Reynolds and Rolf rims on trainers and in the field, no detectable damage or wear could be found on the rim or spokes. While a weight/rim ‘tap’ can be heard on occasion on the trainer and in the field, it has not been an issue. Note: By mentioning the wheel companies above, it does not suggest they recommend or endorse Active Spoke in any way.
5. Are the pieces and springs stainless steel? They are exposed to the elements. The bolt, nut and weight components are fabricated in UpState New York by a high quality medical manufacturer. They are made of brass and then chrome plated. Springs are ‘slivered music wire’. They are spec’d at 70% of their deflection rating (i.e. no deformation) and we have assurances from the manufacturer that they are durable and resistant to typical weather conditions.
6. What happens if the spokes break while riding up a hill (extreme) and you lose all your active spoke pieces down the road? In my opinion, the weight is attached to the spring, which is attached to the bolt, which is securely attached to the spoke at the hub. Also, the weights components themselves are securely tightened with spring washers. If a spoke broke, the Active Spoke assembly would remain intact and remain with the spoke (...on or off the wheel!). Just my opinion... as it has not occurred and was not part of our testing protocol.
7. How about if I prefer my favorite wheel magnet on the non-drive side? There are many configurations that Active Spoke weights are installed on a wheel. Other than one configuration, every method has available spokes where a magnet can be installed. The one configuration mentioned, is a high speed setup for a wheel that has only 8 available spokes and uses 8 x 1oz weights. As a solution, this could be changed to a 4 x 1.5oz or a 6 x 1.5oz. See our wheel configuration page for details.
8. Wont they stir up some aero drag? Good question. Our field trials and their presented results used the same approach and configuration as our production product. So, with the added drag, the results still showed the advantages stated. We have a Active Spoke disc wheel in development - expected to be released later this year (see John Cobb's Active Spoke 'proof of concept' disc)
9. Will the UCI approve of it? We have a core team member, Eric Berchtold, based in Geneva Switzerland. He is engaging with UCI. Submissions need to be in before June and if UCI rules in our favor, it will come into effect on Jan 1, 2009. How they will rule...is too early to tell. We think our Model Study (see pt 1) will help as it shows efficiency enhancements rather than energy storage - much like changing gears using a derailleur.
10. I have more area to clean now :( You're right ! It's really just a brushing while expanding and contracting the spring back and forth.
Lastly, a note on the course. Active Spoke is most effective on a course with changing contours i.e. rolling. It's not effective for accelerations when you're already at high speed as the weights are already out. So criteriums and other position jockeying situation may be a challenge. Right now, we think triathlons and time trials (esp with an Active Spoke disc) are the primary applications.